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Note to self: It doesn't work very reliably. And one can always wonder if it's not coincidence anyway.

This is an argument for doing magick where I care about the actual result. If my actual wishes are fulfilled by accident, I will still be happy.

This returns me to Carrol, who says "I do not participate in parapsychology experiments, and I advise my students not to do so. Magic works capriciously and non-repeatably. We should not squander our abilities on things that do not really matter to us."

https://www.specularium.org/magic/the-dean-radin-pete-carroll-rap

>  so if you know the admin there I would be very thankful if you could ask them to let "the blues doctor" join ;)

Frater Alysyrose – one of the two founders of the Domus Kaotica – happened to be online :)

You're in.

To my knowledge, the reddit is unused.

> Also big thanks for your explanations about the LS! I think I will try out the dot next time:)

You're welcome. You bring a breath of fresh air, both to the forum and the LS tagging. Obviously not all tags are posted about, and nor do they have to be, but it's still very nice to get some of the activity I like :) (You'll see in the group, that posts are very often off-topic. Feel free to start threads about magick and LS tags, even if you don't see any :D )

Hi BluesMage :)

Sorry for taking so long to approve your account. My mistake.

Welcome to the forum.

> Looks a bit like I got here after the party has long ended

The party goes on as long as the LS tags go on, and they do. Just not here on the forum, sadly.

If you want to talk to more members, you can find us on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/groups/DomusKaoticaMarauderUnderground/ and Discord https://discord.com/invite/qkxvqrMXPP – some are in both places, some only in one. I'm on FB for example – well, and also here on the forum :D

> the dot, as some say it represents Ellis and I do not have a strong connection to her

The dot – in my mind – ties your LS to all others. It's kind of the connector. So I recommend doing it.

However, this is the DKMU – try out your own approach and see how it goes :) . The proof of the pudding is in the eating, while the proof of the LS tag I think is in whether you feel the energy around it, or an energy influx into yourself.

> While making the sigil I focused on a positive intend (as filter) to bring making into this world

Jup, filter according to you desire, nice.

> That was a place that felt magical and powerful to me, but also violated. I hoped to revive it.

I like this a lot.

> with this sigil I link the worlds

The tradition is "And Upon This Mark, I Unite The Worlds" – AUTM:IUTW. But once again, you do you :)

> but very strange and unfamiliar. I got goosebumps.

Welcome to the current. I feel that you can call yourself a Marauder now, if you want.

In case you're curious, the "Marauder" part of our Domus Kaotica and Marauder Underground is a reference to https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Marauder – "Within the bubble of alternate reality that surrounds them, their hallucinations and bizarre rules are real; objects and creatures that come into contact with the bubble are transformed to fit in with its rules."

Speaking of Energy, Mulberry from the BALG forum has a mini-guide on how to get it, instead of e.g. pranic vampirism:

"Full body or pore breathing. You visualise the energy you want to cultivate, I like to send my mind out as far to the edges of the cosmos as I can imagine, and see the energy flowing in and filling your body with your breath.

Then, as you breath in, instead of just breathing in through your mouth, see you entire skin all over breathing in the energy through your pores and energy points as well.
As the in breath completes, your body is full of light, or Qi.

Here's the trick: on the out breath, visualise compressing that Qi into one of your Dan Tians. These are energy centers that act as storage for QI. Try to fill them, and compress the energy in them to pack more in, over and over. After a while they tend to start glowing in your minds eye.

Lusting after power is forbidden in qigong, but it's known that as your qi cultivation improves psychic senses and 'special functions' as they are called, automatically awaken."

Hi everyone :)

You might know I tried lots and lots of things to get a short term external effect. Candle flames, incense smoke, a milligram scales, a sensitive thermometer, an EMF meter, lots of dice... and probably other things that I don't remember anymore.

I think I finally found something. it has to be something where there are many variables, and where you are involved a lot, because it's easier to influence your body then something else. So scales and thermometers don't do it. How about throwing a single die and catching it? We tried a few rounds, aiming for 2:

2,5,2,1,2,5
6,2,2,6,3,2
4,2,6,3,2,1
6,4,1,1,1,4

Yeah, the first 12 throws head six 2s. The probability of 3 in 6 is I think ~5%.  Twice in a row will of course be much less. But it's not very pleasant to catch a die and the calculations are slightly complicated.

So we switched to coins. The classic coin toss, where it turns a lot. You do the throw and also the catch. Many variables and you are involved a lot. Here are a few results:

-,+,+,+,+
+,-,-,-,+
+,+,+,-,+
-,+,+,-,+
4+2+4+3 = 13
13 of 20
13 * 5 = 65%

Four in a row happen occasionally – probability 0.5^4 = 1 / 16 = 0.0625 = 6.25%. Once I had 11 correct throws in a row – probability = 0,000488281 = 0,048%.

Of course I tried tossing the same coin without magick, and no, it does not fall on the same side a lot.

So I really recommend trying this. Most of what we do is holding the coin in the flip position, and then charging it. More specifically, we charge the arm and the coin with "We get heads" or so, and the happiness that we will feel then. Pour a lot of energy into it. Like really go all out for a few seconds. Then flip the coin and try to keep the energy flow going at least a little during the spin and the catch.

[Exercise #1: Energy Ball]

I realised that this kind of lacks the basics. How to feel some energy in the first place. Here's what the book says

Exercise #1: Energy Ball

1. Breathe in and out. Imagine that as you breathe in and out, the invisible vital energy from around you is filling you.
2. Rub your hands together vigorously. Imagine that an invisible energy that you have gathered, is coming together where you rub your hands.
3. Keep rubbing your hands together.
4. Stop rubbing your hands, and then move them about an inch apart.
5. Move your hands closer to about a quarter inch apart, and then back to an inch a part.
6. Do this several times. You will feel warmth or a pressure. This is energy.
7. Repeat steps 1 through 5, but this time cup your hands together to make a ball made from that sensation of warmth of pressure.
8. Repeat steps 1 through 6, but make the ball larger and smaller. See what happens if you try to change how the ball feels. Play with different sensations.
9. When done, gently reabsorb your energy ball into your body. You can do this by thinking of your hand sucking it in, or even breathing it in. Play with different methods of doing this.

You can just learn to feel this energy, and to move it through visualisation, in rhythm with your breathing. For me, it's mainly about feeling it flow into a sigil or visualisation, or feeling it swirl around me. For the above exercise, try to get more of that feeling, push more energy into the ball. This is probably a good exercise for a beginner, to know that all this is real :)

[Distance Sigil Healing]

Here are two more concrete examples

Distance Sigil Healing

While energy is not confined to time or space in many ways, I find it satisfying to send energy directly to those in need.
1. Make a statement of intent for someone to be healed.
2. Create a sigil and a word of power out of the statement.
3. As you make the sigil in the air energetically, imagine it is a portal sending the healing energies to the target directly – letting the energy go where it needs to.
4. Focus on sending healing.
5. When done, close the portal and banish the sigil.

The Magickal Dart

When you need to directly affect a situation and end a conflict – this is the way. I use these in extreme situations. This is like having a loaded gun and I recommend that you treat this working as the weapons it is. [..] The dart pierces the aura and can go deep into the target's energy body.
1. Form energy in your projective hand in a ball or any other shape.
2. Put as much energy and emotion into that shape.
3. Feel and transform the shape into something that looks kind of pointy and sharp.
4. Cut the cord between you and the energy dart.
5. Throw the energetic dart at your target. Imaging it is piercing their aura and hitting straight into their energetic body.
6. Banish, purify, ground, and center.

I very much recommend this book :)

[Intent]

I've recently read a book called Energy Magick by Mark NeCamp Jr., which I liked a lot. I want to share some highlights:

A spell is done in four parts:

Intent – Your intent drives everything in magick. Thoughts shape energy and keeping your thoughts in order and your intention clear lead towards more effective magick. I like to write a "statement of intent" and memorize it. [...] a statement of intent can be used to make personal sigils and words of power.

Energetic Means – What is the energetic medium your spell is going to be? Are you working with cords, energetic constructs, chanting, sending energy directly, or something else? The energetic component is the body of the spell. Are you making a magickal dart? Are you sending a wave of energy? Are you making a thought form?
[...] In my example of making extra money – I could enchant my hand with luck energy before I picked a lottery ticket, I could send energy to my boss for a raise, or I could make a thought form that helped me make decisions that would create more wealth.

Release – The release is how we send the energy out into the world. This may be letting energy built to a climax and then released to the Universe, "planting" your intention in the Earth, sending it out to a specific person or direction, or releasing it in every direction. Different things work for different people, and I would advocate experimenting to see what works best. [...]

Physical Work & Result – I was taught that whatever magick you do, you must do the accompanying work or action in the physical world. If you are doing a spell to get a new job, it would probably be wise to put out resumes and apply for jobs. That being said, the Universe will often use synchronicity to make things happen. [...]

I asked for more details about Spellblast and Arjil answered:
___________
On spellblast,
It takes a very literal "energy model". Magick as a tangible Power you can infuse with intent, or into things- feel it channel into the construct or item, and then cast or throw it.
Mayhap its more of the "RPG" model of magick. So many paradigms are like Sims, or are ceremonial- an overview, sort of. Creating favorable conditions, petitioning some entity or another to Do the Thing from on high.
This is like... imagine the first two fingers of your right hand.
Make that hand a cattle prod. Feel the magick infuse your fingers and *skizzat* your buddy.
When it works, its Ever so much worse in an ineffable way.
Or like one time Silenced nailed me. He got a handful of pine needles, infused that with "splinterstorm", and hit me with it. On This side of the "fence" i got hit with pine needles. On the *Other side, I experienced silver needles blasting through me. I got knocked ass over teakettle. By a handful of pine needles.
Would that have worked on someone not in that *place? Not generally, not until youve Really got it. We were open to that sort of exchange.
"Energy model" is a poor descriptor, but its the closest to what I mean, in concept.
I mean the psipog people did this with psiballs. The omnimancer people do this via astral (these are more like what youre trying to do over video- which I think is problematic, Ill explain why)
But this is how we learned to Feel magick, and Put it where we wanted it to go.
Infuse a Thing, infuse a construct, infuse Ourself, a Mantle (construct you wear)
Like all the ways we can hold our minds, things we imagine- theres a Difference between just imaginary, and that infused with Magick. With power.
Theres *Something* you have to get in to that to make it more real.
Heres how *I* do- and I dont much talk about this because how YOU can make it happen may be different:
I have a door in my soul and center that opens to somewhere Else. I draw power that seems to me as mist from there. Sometimes Ill tap external things like the moon, sun, mountains, mystic swamp, fire etc- i will take the feelings of those things that are relevant (mostly just Mine) and I will FEEL that and guide it through my body, into hands or breath and Into whatever mental construct or physical object Im doing "The Thing" to.
Either empowering the spell Im throwing into the world or at sombody, or infusing it into some physical thing or symbol, or whatever.
Take a knife. I do this to a knife, i have a knife that can cut spooks, works better than a knife should work, or an instant ritual blade.
For instance- i accidentally sliced Silenced open with a boffer knife (extremely fake training blade foam and duct tape), because I slipped too real and power went there.
Boffers cant do that. It did anyway. It was Almost a real knife for a second.
Do that to a real knife and, well, be careful.
And these examples arent what Matters.
What Matters is you getting whatever Power magick is, into things, ideas, and making them do a Thing. And have fun with it.
Be careful when it starts to hurt.
And the point of this little game, is for You and the Magick, to go as your mind goes. To be fast and hard. No fuss, not working yourself up to believing it. To DO it when you need it Right here, Right Now.
Its practice for when it Matters, and you dont have time to think about it.

I have another result to report :) – this time a positive one.

A friend of mine is a bit of an empath. So I wanted to try this with him:

https://mikesententia.com/2017/12/how-i-learn-and-teach-energy-energy-games-that-get-results/

"The receiver [...] closes their eyes, and holds out both hands. The sender sends to one of their hands — don't tell them which one, and don't touch them, just send energy and get them to feel it. Receiver, take your time, feel the energy, and say which hand you think it is before opening your eyes."

I generated a random sequence with https://www.random.org/integers/?num=16&min=0&max=1&col=4&base=10&format=html&rnd=new and we did 15 trials with me sending and him receiving. He got 12 right :) . The probability of this happening at random is <2%.

We'll definitely continue with that.

In my text, I mention Liber Samekh, but apparently I hadn't really read it. It contains this nice highlight:

Until the Adept have heard that Name, therefore, he may not abide in the perfect possession of his Beloved. His most important task is thus to open his ears to the voice of his Angel, that he may know him, how he is called. For hearken! this Name, understood rightly and fully, declareth the nature of the Angel in every point, wherefore also that Name is the formula of the perfection to which the Adept must aspire, and also of the power of Magick by virtue whereof he must work.

https://hermetic.com/crowley/libers/lib800

[Arjil's sigil theory-]

Also copied from FB, after Arjil said that he liked this thread :)

"Something for peer review, I know I'm missing bits, but I can't figure out quite what. So consider this a rough draft- questions, comments, thoughts welcome:

Arjil's sigil theory-

So, most chaotes are familiar with the Sparian sigil theory- the whole subconscious programming schtick, and yeah, it's great, works just fine. However, over the last twenty or so years especially, we've discovered other ways to approach, empower, and Use the sigil concept.
It seems, that the Way you think about and approach the concept, all the way from inception to post firing makes a difference in how they work and what you can do with them.
The first place I saw this explored, for instance, was back in the day on the old Occultforums 10 or 15 years ago. We had a "blind sigil post" experiment to determine whether someone Else could successfully fire a sigil You made, without knowing what it was For.
We figured, that if it was merely a matter of personal subconscious programming, then there's No way for that to work, Unless the intent was somehow infused into the symbol itself- as with commonly used magickal symbols like runes or goetic seals, or whatever.
So many of us made various sigils, and sent them to the mod along with the intent, and he posted the image in the forum, we all fired them and reported back anything that seemed like a result.
What we discovered was that sometimes, other people Could fire somebody else's sigil, and achieve results at least recognizable in the intent. (they seemed to vary a bit, person to person, but the general idea tended to come through.- the one I created was basically a 3rd eye squeege. The 4 or 5 people that it worked for, out of 10 or 12 who fired it, all reported some form of jump in "magickal perception")
Like I said, if "personal subconscious programming" were the only thing going on there, there's No Way that could have worked. Clearly, there's more to this- some of which seems "no brainer" now, but at the time was a hotly contested topic.
So, I'll just launch into the ways in which I use, and view sigilcraft, and hopefully you'll find something of use or interest in here-
(***a couple base assumptions I make in regards to magick- One being a somewhat mystic view. I deal with magick sort of like a combination of "The Force", and what in a faerie tale/RPG/fantasy book etc would be considered Magick- a force, a power, a current, you know, Just Effing Magick. Secondly, and related, I approach sigils from a Runes of Power, or active spell construct perspective. They have power or resonance of their own, if you craft them from this perspective, though I acknowledge it's not the only valid perspective***)
Broadly, there seem to be some main Themes in sigil constructs-
Specific- single use, designed for very specific situation (Get Me *this* Job). Non reusable, tends to only work on the Creator of the sigil or their intended target. Other people firing it would get no result, but can, depending on how it was made, further empower the spell (more on this later)
Tech- more general construct, (sigil for prosperity/curse/healing/whatever- any sort of spell you would Cast). Reusable, easily modified by others to fit their specific situation. Tends to work on the Caster, or their intended target. Other people firing it would see the result manifest in their Own reality, rather than empowering the creator's original spell.
Talismanic- sigil construct charged and maintained for a sustained magickal effort. Either a literal talisman (protection, say), servitor, glamourbomb, entity, symbolize a current etc. Reusable. Works in accordance with programmed intent. Most recognizable symbols of the occult would (loosely) fit this category, as Somebody was the first one to draw them and decide they meant Magick.
My favored uses/views for sigils are
A) a "spell filter"- (falling into either the "Specific" or "Tech" category) that being an intentional construct upon/through which I can focus my will/channel my magick, I only bother if it's too complex a construct to just hold in my head. The benefit here is that I don't have to split focus between my intent and the raising and throwing of the magick. I can focus entirely on the magick bit, and that gets programmed as it "passes through" the sigil construct.
This is also extremely effective for group work, as many people of disparate paradigms and methods can all throw down on such a construct, empowering it in whatever way they "do their thing" and the sigil ensures all that voo goes toward the same end rather than everybody working at cross purposes and getting all tangled up. It's much like the role of a high priestess in Pagan ritual work- the coven raises the energy, the priestess shapes it all into the same spell. Same concept, and quite effective.
B) Talismanic- explained above, I that should cover it for those who know what they're doing... may need to talk more about it.
When creating my sigils, especially the "spell filter" type I use a "Schematic" sort of notion.
Instead of a simple statement of intent that then gets broken down to letters (Spare method), I usually begin with my target and write that down, then use simple words and phrases (even poetry if that seems appropriate) that boils down the essence of my broader intent, along with boxes, circles, arrows, lines, swirleys and simple doodles to map out what I want the magick to do (such as draw in certain resonances/possibilities and exclude others, for instance)- I write everything in my own alphabet designed specifically for magick to cut out interference from outside association (different discussion for another day), and with my words and symbols, as I write or draw them, I channel "Magick" into each one, holding the broader intent behind that bit in my mind, and Literally channeling *energy/chi/will/elemental force/magick/whatever* along with the resonant connection to what that symbol stands for, down my arm, through the pen, Into the symbol to make it a real thing independent of Me that exists as a magickal construct (that's the theory anyway, seems to work pretty darn well).
Then for charging/firing, I use my usual direct manipulation method of magick throwing. I summon up my Will and Magick, focus on the sigil construct, and blow the magick Into or Through it. Though Any spellcasting method/ritual/energy raising technique will do the trick- the Gnosis angle, yeah it works, but I find that an intentional, focused, "Putting Magick To It" works better- and many times, with people going the gnosis route, there's a disconnect between the activity at hand (lol) and getting the energy raised Into the magickal operation, relying on the subconscious to do all the work at this point.
Again, yeah, that works. Some may find it the penultimate practice. I and a number of others find it terribly lacking after long experimentation.
I get it that there's a bias against the "energy model" especially among chaotes and "Psych model" folks. But it's worth experimenting with. It's been my long experience that the sigil charged and fired through intentionally channeled magick, or ritual, beats the one somebody just rubbed one out over every time. The Magick Matters, or really seems to.
***yes, you can get there just "holding your mind right", making the gnostic act, an act of magick, but that doesn't seem common. I'm making a somewhat fine distinction here of mental state and intent, and I hope I get that across.***
Hopefully, this glimpse into my mind and method will help people become more effective in their sigilcraft."

I tried 2. with no success – it's also not very interesting.

Then I went crazy and actually tried 3. Bought two beakers, weighted two times 3,5g of yeast with a milligram scales (which I bought for for other occult experiments) and two times 7g of sugar, and mixed it in warm water.

It smelled very strangely :O , the contents of the two beakers looked different from the start and I didn't see the nice even foam that was in the video. So I quickly microwaved this to deactivate the yeast and poured it all away :D

I think I'll quit this topic and focus on doing magick for what I actually care about. There's a nice chat between Pope Pete and Dean Radin about this, where Carrol says "I do not participate in parapsychology experiments, and I advise my students not to do so. Magic works capriciously and non-repeatably. We should not squander our abilities on things that do not really matter to us."
https://www.specularium.org/magic/the-dean-radin-pete-carroll-rap

Edit 31.08.25
I tried some more ideas, with cards and dice, to not much success. However, I had a realisation: There is something that gives immediate feedback: The intensity of the sensation! In other words, how strongly I feel the magick, the energy flow. And the best results in the exercises also came mostly when that was strongest.

Reporting my results – the experiment has failed. The roses in the red vase don't look any better than those in the other one. It was very instructive though.

The basic problem is of course that I didn't put enough time into it. Maybe only 5 minutes per day. The underlying issue is – I don't know how much time is needed. Maybe it needs 10 minutes per day, maybe 30... and if I only do 5, I don't see that it's too little, until the roses visibly start wilting and it's too late. So now I'd need a second run with more time, but it's not very motivating – maybe it needs 30 min per day and I also have plenty of other magick to do...

Also I found that despite the description on the flower food, I did have to change the water after three or four days, at it really became dirty. I think I even saw some mold, which I certainly didn't want in my apartment.

What do I learn from this? Flowers are not very suitable for the creation of a measurable effect. I think I need a process that runs for 10-30 minutes. Sit down, give it full focus, and get a result after that time. This also has the advantage that it's easy to capture on camera.

Current ideas:

• Get an hourglass that runs for 10 minutes. Run it a few times and measure with a stopwatch how long it actually takes. See if you can make it slower or faster on further runs. I tried this with a 1 minute hourglass with no success. It's not very interesting :D
• Light two birthday candles at the same time. They normally burn for about 10 minutes. Make one burn faster than the other – I imagine watching a moving flame is more interesting than an hourglass.
• An idea behind the flower seems to be that perhaps influencing living cells is easier than inanimate objects. So I asked a friend in biochemistry what other living cells might be good for that. Answer: Baker's yeast! These are dried bacteria, and in contact with warm water they come back to life. If there is sugar, they immediately start turning it into CO2, creating very visible rising foam in 15 minutes! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4Tzyt_9boE
  One could take two such beakers with the same amount of sugar and yeast, and try to make one rise faster, i.e. make the bacteria work quicker.

I think the above, while quite good, is slightly more complex than necessary. Because if you can send an energy ball to your target, why not send energy to the target directly. Distance is famously not real on the Astral plane. So how do I actually work with my new roses?

I have my intention – "The roses in the red vase are healthy and in great shape". The vases are actually both the same glass cylinders, but one has a red dot and one a black one :D .

I focus on this intention and make green, healing energy flow into the roses in the correct vase. I see them shining brightly. I feel very positively about it – that's an effect doing magick always has on me. Sometimes I do this remotely, and sometimes while looking at the physical roses. Sometimes I also project a healing sigil I made many years ago, drawn over the roses in green light.

So basically "Imagine all your positive intent flowing into the orb", just not into some orb, but directly into the target. "[V]isualize it reaching the person you'd like to heal. Imagine their body absorbing the orb, and the positive energy flowing throughout them", again just skipping the orb. This – to me – is Magick. The rest is commentary :D – at least when it comes to Low Magick or "Manifesting". The High Magick I covered elsewhere.

This energy sending approach can be infinitely adapted to other targets and other intents. You can also project a visualised Tarot card onto the target to clarify the effect of your energy. The Strength for healing, the Ten of Pentacles, even Death – you get the idea. If you want to make something happen and there is no "target" as such, visualise the desired situation, hold your intent, and send the energy into those. 

The key to this is of course that it has to be more than visualisation. You have to actually make the energy flow, not just imagine it. Feel the flow as you are visualising it.

I will repeat my favourite Arjil quote:

"You know how you can recall the feeling of a physical sensation or an Emotion? Like the feel of wind, or drinking something cold, or stubbing your toe, or excitement- and you can, if you concentrate, Feel it?

So what you do, Pretending to be a Wizard, just imagine what *Your* magick Feels like, what it would look like blasting out as a spell- Kids don't worry about How it will work, they just do it, usually with some impressive whooshing sound effect. Or maybe your magick is quiet and creeps like tendrils of smoke, or flows like water.

Summon the vision, and more importantly, summon the Feeling, and Pretend like a kid that you're casting your spell, and like a kid, Believe it."

This quote to me is worth more than many books on magick combined.